HPR4754: BruCon interviews part2: Lockpicking

This show has been flagged as Clean by the host. TOOOL T he O pen O rganisation O f L ockpickers https://toool.nl/Toool MIT Guide to Lock Picking: https://www.lockwiki.com/index.php/MIT_Guide_to_Lock_Picking Provide feedback on this episode .

22/10/2026Duración no disponible

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In this interview recorded at BruCON 2026, Kristof speaks with Sarah from the hackerspace Co-op in Mechelen. They discuss the presence of hackerspaces at cybersecurity conferences and explore the techniques, tools, and mental models required for lock picking.

Idea clave 1Hackerspaces like Co-op provide a connection to the original hacker culture and ethical hacking at security conferences.

Idea clave 2Lock picking is taught using see-through cylinder locks to help beginners understand the internal mechanism.

Idea clave 3Successful lock picking requires developing a 3D mental model of the lock's interior while working by feel.

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Adapted from “HPR4754: BruCon interviews part2: Lockpicking” by Hacker Public Radio, licensed under CC BY-SA 4.0.

This transcript was generated by speech recognition and the summary and chapters by AI, so they can contain errors. BestPodcast is not affiliated with the creator. These adaptations are available under the same license.

This is Hacker Public Radio episode 4754 for Thursday the 22nd of October 2026. Today's show is entitled BruCON interviews part two, lock picking. It is part of the series interviews. It is hosted by Kristof and is about 14 minutes long. It carries a clean flag. The summary is Kristof talks to Sarah of Co-op on the art of lock picking.

Hi everybody. Welcome to an exciting new episode of Hacker Public Radio. My name is Kristof and today we continue the series of interviews done at BruCON 2026. BruCON is a conference mainly aimed at cyber security, but it does include a number of activities that does fit into the hacker culture. Hacker that is as in the meaning of HPR, Hacker Public Radio. In this interview, I talked to Sarah from Co-op, a hackerspace in Mechelen, about the stand they organized at BruCON, a stand on the art or is it the sport of lock picking.

Let's get started. Good morning, Sarah. I'm getting Sarah of Co-op. Yeah. Um so I'll let you first introduce yourself and what you do here. Yeah. So I'm um BruCON here and I'm here because of Co-op um because Co-op is a hackerspace in Mechelen and since a few years we are partnering at BruCON at in that sense that we provide some entertainment, I would say, and so for example this year we made the arcade Okay, the the arcade Yeah, the car the games arcade machines, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So we're going to have still have an interview with one of the of the Awesome Retro. Yeah. So um and um every year we um or the years that we were here already, uh we also provide like a little hackerspace at BruCON uh to give people to give the attendees an an idea and a sense of what is a hackerspace and Yes, because you talk about hackerspace. So we have the word hacker now. There is of course the word hacker in the original meaning of the word as it being as it's Hacker Public Radio.

So people should know what hacker is about. But you also have the hacker in cyber security and this is a cyber security conference. Yeah. Do you see that people kind of mix it? I mean, do the cyber cyber security people know the hacker culture? Um I think it's mixed. I think some people know it. Some people are familiar with it and know it indeed in the sense that we are more kind of the ethical hackers and and the the hackers who want to understand systems. Yes.

But there is also people who haven't encountered hackerspaces before. So I think that is also the reason that BruCON finds it interesting to have this here at the conference to give this as an inspiring place to to give people a new experience of this. Yeah. And as being hackerspace, you do a very hackerspace thing that is lock picking. Yeah, indeed, indeed. Um uh So we try to provide a few techniques to try out and indeed a lock picking is one of them where we have a little in the villages we have a little table where people can try out the lock picking.

Um Okay. Because lock picking is one of those things that you see at hacker conferences. What do people first first when when somebody first encounters the problem of lock picking? Mhm. How does it work? Um what I notice here is that also maybe because of the mixed public. So some people, probably those who are already a bit familiar with the hacker culture, they know it and they say, "Oh, nice, some lock picking, interesting." There is some enthusiasm. And then there is people, I think, who haven't at least they they they never tried at least.

And then they when they see the lock picking table, they're also I see that they are also they have blisters in their eyes like Um It could be a problem combination with fear or like How did you do that? It's a mixture, I think, of interest indeed and and wondering like, "Oh, okay, what is this and and and so and then well some people dare to come closer, I would say, and and and try to find out like what is it about and how does it work and and what can I see there?

Okay. No, but just for people who do not know, I don't know if that's the audience here, but okay. So lock picking is What exactly? Yeah. So lock picking is the the the art maybe or the at least the technique of picking locks. What what what Opening a door, opening a lock of a Opening a lock and yeah, often it's it's about locks of doors indeed or I think that's also where it started. But of course it can also be a lock of your bicycle lock or it can be all kinds of all kinds of locks of course.

Yeah. Oh, yeah. But the basic technique is indeed the one of a cylinder lock which you find on doors and So I guess first thing you do is you try to explain what actually is a lock and how a lock works, I guess. I've seen you had some pictures. Yes, yes, that's why we have the pictures indeed. Um because with lock picking what you try to do is trying to do what your key does but in a different way. Like without the key, trying to open that lock.

So you have certain kind of tools um and you don't need a lot of tools but uh there are some tools and with those tools you try to open that lock as you would with the I I think I haven't seen it here but I think I saw some other place where they actually had a lock that was kind of in glass or something that you could actually look inside. Yeah. Because for me personally, I tried it once and I was completely not able to do it.

No. I frankly do not have a 3D image in my head of how stuff works. I guess that's one of the things you actually need you need to have a 3D image of what a lock looks like. Yeah, I think it's very hard to try lock picking without knowing what is inside the cylinder. And I I also see it here then um when people see the pictures, it gets more clear and indeed to to exercise the lock picking, you have these locks which are shine through which you you can look through.

And I think that's a good way to start with lock picking because um there you can actually see what the mechanism is and what you are trying to do with the tools that you are using. So but then you have to do without seeing it. So you kind of have to have a model mental model of that in your head. Yeah. Yeah, afterwards, yeah. Yeah, yeah, that's the next step. When you understood what your tools are doing and what your locking is doing, then you are trying then the next step is trying to do the same thing but without seeing what what is happening.

Do the most people actually succeed in that? Um I don't know if we can say the most people but I don't have statistics. I mean I mean the here at the here at BruCON, I mean. I think it takes a lot of exercise. So when you have done these see-through locks, I don't think it's the first time you pick up a normal lock, I would say. I don't think you will immediately succeed to open it. I think it will take some efforts before before this works as well, yeah.

Yeah. So it's a perhaps strange question but can you use lock picking outside for I mean except for other things than locks? If you are trained in doing lock picking, would it help for other things? Um Just I don't know. Stupid question perhaps. No, no, no stupid question. Actually, I was a colleague of at Co-op, he was telling me that um lock picking is also an interesting overlap between BruCON and cyber security and and hackerspaces because because lock picking can be useful in the basics of physical pen testing.

Now, I don't know much about that so I can't tell you much more about it but maybe that's already an answer Just the fact only by imagining the world as a 3D mental thing, I guess. If you understand that in front of of a door or something else or in front of building that you need to have a kind of mental image of how things I don't know. Just we're just guessing here. Certainly So if it's wrong, there's a comment section under this interview so I just say please comment.

Yeah. Okay. Do you see perhaps do you see a difference certain people are good and others are not good? Do you see logic in there? I don't know. Younger, older, perhaps male, female? I don't think that I can already say like I see that that there's a line in these kind of peoples or or or age if it comes to age or if it comes to gender or if it comes to those kind of things. But lock ping lock picking is really a lot about patience.

Yeah, I think you said that you need you need a lot of patience. Yeah. And also about a certain sensitivity because you have you really need to feel very small changes in your lock. So I think that people who are more able But but but to do that Yeah, yeah. Okay. Yeah. Uh what exactly do you need to do lock picking? So you need a lock picking kit, I guess. Yeah. Can you just get it some I don't know probably not at the shop or I don't know where do you get actually get those?

See, buy them from AliExpress and then you get stopped at the customs? Yeah. Well, as I as I said, you don't need a lot actually to do lock picking. The you basically need two tools which is one is called a tension wrench and then the other is another wrench. And this second wrench can have different kinds of shapes and it's there is not like one shape that fits one certain lock or it's really about finding the right wrench at that time for your lock and for your handling I would say.

But the tension wrench is always the same one. But where do you get them? I guess you can't just go to any shop to get them. So you get them from the internet and mostly you never had problems that got stopped by customs? Um as far as I know, no. Actually, no. But there is also because you mentioned AliExpress for example, of course, you can find those things there. But there is also a few websites who are about the lock picking lock picking sport, I would say.

Yeah, physical sport and because you said it was an art so it's Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, can I think it can be seen as as as different in different ways. And there you they also sometimes sell those tools. Yeah. So That's very interesting. Yeah. Uh how do people react if you say that you want to lock picking? I mean outside the hacker community? I think most people have this um thought at least like hm. Maybe some people are interested and open like to question like, "Ah, what is it and and why are you doing this?"

But I think most of the people will have this extra thought like hm, so what are you using it for actually? So yeah, yeah. Yeah, okay. I get it. Yeah, but actually it really works like that. I think we already had a at least one time but I think a few times where we had a lock inside the hacker community so or at the hackerspace itself and then it was really useful that some people And then I was like, "The door is closed. We lost the key.

Who is it? Sarah, would you Sarah, please please come to the space. We have a problem." Yeah. So Okay. Yeah. Indeed. Very interesting. Thank you very much, You're welcome. And I hope you enjoy the rest of BruCON and teach some people how to well break into doors. Yeah, something like that. Okay. But maybe it's also uh and less I need um when I see people lock picking, um it's I think that's why I call it like a sport or hobby an art. It can be different things.

Um because um for me sometimes it looks like women who are knitting or crocheting. It's it it sometimes looks like the same in in same kind of activity when people are So if you get if you get a man to do lock picking and just you know if you can do that, your next step is here. You can knit this. Yeah. Yeah, I I I see it more like you can sit at in at home you can sit next to your wife or maybe you it's different it's different you know but yeah.

Or whatever but okay of course Yeah and and you know lock or yeah and as a as a as a mental Yeah. as a mental trick to get some kind of mindfulness or some kind of yeah like that. Okay. No. That's good your tea time if you do that indeed. And a bit of quiet music in the background and Yeah. forget all your problems of the day and open and break some locks. Okay, or open some locks. Yeah, yeah. Okay. Indeed. Especially indeed. Thank you very much, Sarah.

You're welcome. My You have been listening to the Hacker Public Radio Podcast at hackerpublicradio.org. Today's show was contributed by a HPR listener like yourself. If you ever thought of recording a podcast, then visit the HPR site to find out how easy it really is. Hosting for HPR has been kindly provided by an honest host.com, the Internet Archive, rsync.net, and the HPR community content delivery network. Unless otherwise stated, today's show is released under a Creative Commons Attribution Share Alike 4.0 International license.

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